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 Post subject: Chrysler museum petition
PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 1:50 pm 
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I was wondering what others in the DB club may think of putting together a petition of DBC members along with other Chrysler enthusiasts to see if we could possibly get the leaders at FCA or Chrysler to reopen the museum for research enthusiasts.

Anyone else interested in seeing it reopened for this purpose and would a petition from different Chrysler groups be the best way to go about it?


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:55 pm 
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I think that horse died. It has already been closed, opened, and reclosed. We barely got in back in 2014. If you can believe what you read on the internet Ram and Jeep are for sale and Chrysler cars are just about toast.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 8:22 pm 
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If that’s the case then even more of a reason to have access to the museum


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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2019 5:50 pm 
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DavidYoung wrote:
If that’s the case then even more of a reason to have access to the museum


I've been trying to get access to build cards for months now. The other threads on this forum and the AACA forum about DB build cards list addresses, phone numbers, contact names, and even the names of Chrysler departments that don't exist anymore. I just saw your post from back in February of this year (2019) and I've sent Dannielle another email. The last time I tried I got an immediate robo reply that she didn't exist - so far this time there's no immediate robo replies so there's hope. Of course, it could just be that I've typed the email address wrong and I've been emailing the wrong person the whole time - wouldn't be the first time.

Preserving the history of these great cars is why I got into this hobby and why I bought the cars I have in the first place - 1921 and 1925 DB Touring Cars.

It just seems logical to be able to have access to the Chrysler museum... Or... to get Chrysler to donate their DB collections to the DB Club or the AACA Library like the DB Club has done.

Anyway, I'm all for trying to help you if it preserves the DB history and documents for many future generations to come. Plus, I still need a copy of my build cards.

-TR


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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2019 6:42 pm 
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Today's report of them emerging with Renault might be another nail in the coffin. Tom, the DBC did not donate our collection to the AACA library. We pay to store it there and anyone has access to it anywhere in the world. We can take it back anytime we want, but that would be foolish. It is safe, there are three professional librarians there, and easily accessible. The library will soon have it's new search available to use. If you look under the garage section to the left you can see the list of DB manuals we own. Also you can view the 3400 Budd photographs and about 2000 pages of loose papers. There are many boxes of literature not listed here, you have to look in the online catalog of AACA library for that. Most of the DB videos on utube from the AACA library belong to the DBC, but are made available to watch by the library. It is a near perfect relationship. That is why several other major car clubs store their literature at AACA, Pierce Arrow Soc'y, NCRS, Vintage Chevrolet, among others.


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 2:53 pm 
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DougWalters wrote:
Today's report of them emerging with Renault might be another nail in the coffin. Tom, the DBC did not donate our collection to the AACA library. We pay to store it there and anyone has access to it anywhere in the world. We can take it back anytime we want, but that would be foolish. It is safe, there are three professional librarians there, and easily accessible. The library will soon have it's new search available to use. If you look under the garage section to the left you can see the list of DB manuals we own. Also you can view the 3400 Budd photographs and about 2000 pages of loose papers. There are many boxes of literature not listed here, you have to look in the online catalog of AACA library for that. Most of the DB videos on utube from the AACA library belong to the DBC, but are made available to watch by the library. It is a near perfect relationship. That is why several other major car clubs store their literature at AACA, Pierce Arrow Soc'y, NCRS, Vintage Chevrolet, among others.


Hi Doug,

I spoke to someone at the AACA library (very helpful) who explained the new process to me and I fully understand what's available and what changes are coming. I've searched the database thoroughly countless times now thinking I must be missing something. However, it does not hold any further answers that a researcher would need to fill in the blanks (for trucks at least). It's mostly common materials like catalogs and such that most of us already have. Nothing in there to do with production processes, production dates for changes, etc.. (for trucks). It is very good they are helping and I'm glad they are storing it but there really isn't much depth to it for those of us in the truck community.

As for the photos and docs on the left under the garage section, those have shed more light (many thanks to those that provided them) because they are documents not readily available to the public. Those are the kinds of things (as an example) that I'm sure the Chrysler Museum has and it seems they are hell bent on taking it to the grave with them. God forbid it would be available to those of us that need it for further documenting the history of these trucks (a work that is VERY incomplete for future generations).

Danielle claims it's because of all of the thieves who have stolen material when visiting in the past. Here words, not mine...
If that's the case then that would mean they are clearly in protection mode of what they have on file. Question is, who are they protecting it for …. especially if it's never made available to anyone ?

I just don't get it. SMH


Last edited by DavidYoung on Wed May 29, 2019 3:30 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 3:02 pm 
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ThomasRankin wrote:
DavidYoung wrote:
If that’s the case then even more of a reason to have access to the museum


I've been trying to get access to build cards for months now. The other threads on this forum and the AACA forum about DB build cards list addresses, phone numbers, contact names, and even the names of Chrysler departments that don't exist anymore. I just saw your post from back in February of this year (2019) and I've sent Dannielle another email. The last time I tried I got an immediate robo reply that she didn't exist - so far this time there's no immediate robo replies so there's hope. Of course, it could just be that I've typed the email address wrong and I've been emailing the wrong person the whole time - wouldn't be the first time.

Preserving the history of these great cars is why I got into this hobby and why I bought the cars I have in the first place - 1921 and 1925 DB Touring Cars.

It just seems logical to be able to have access to the Chrysler museum... Or... to get Chrysler to donate their DB collections to the DB Club or the AACA Library like the DB Club has done.

Anyway, I'm all for trying to help you if it preserves the DB history and documents for many future generations to come. Plus, I still need a copy of my build cards.

-TR



Hi Tom, this is the correct email.
I'm confident if you haven't received a mail error message it went through. Usually takes her about a week to respond. If it's been longer you may want to try and resend it. I've sent several other truck owners her way recently with good results (at least they are still providing build cards to owners... :wink: ) so you should have good luck with this link.

danielle.szostak@fcagroup.com

Petitioning the WPC Museum for DB and GB docs for the DBC or the AACA may never work but I feel we have to try (again).


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 4:47 pm 
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David, the reason the library doesn't have much truck stuff because of the interest of the person that collected most of it. He was interested in a small part of the DB history and that is all he collected. That is why I keep asking for those of you that have truck stuff to donate it or at least copies to the DBC so it does good for others. The 2000 pages of info was bought by him from a dealer. As you said there is more truck, Senior, and Victory info then I have seen before. If everyone takes their stash to the grave the rest of will never know about this part of the history. I know some of the guys sitting on big literature collections. As it is it only does them good. I have asked, even for copies. Fill a memory stick and send it so others can learn.


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 6:35 pm 
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I understand, Doug...

we desperately need our own digital library website in my opinion.

If we had a Dodge/Graham Brothers digital library website then everyone could share what they have with each other so everyone benefits, yet keep the originals they purchased for themselves. Win/Win for all... we need everyone's participation though and that's the biggest challenge I see going forward.

In the meantime, hopefully I or someone else can create a dialogue with Danielle that will lead somewhere and hopefully open a door that provides more answers (she has to have a higher up we can deal with). Doubt it will ever happen but it's worth another shot... I can't give up on the WPC Museum just yet.

The docs you loaded are very helpful for sure.
Recently while talking with John B in email I asked the question of what his source was for an article he wrote decades ago as I was trying to clarify some details and hopefully expand on his (and others) incredible work related to trucks, specifically in regards to buses 983 & 984. I was curious because these buses are not listed in any model charts or literature that I could find. He mentioned that he recalled the information came from a "published model and annual production list that used to be in the DB club archives that should now be in the AACA Library possession". I've looked everywhere for it in the AACA catalog and DBC but have had no luck, (maybe I'm missing something). My question is what happened to it and/or how do we find out where it is? If it still exists I'm betting it will hold many other answers for the truck community.


I found one document in the garage section that do verify his findings for the 983 & 984 buses. These are the type of documents that are scattered that should all be in one or two digital locations for future generations...


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 10:45 pm 
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David, if you know the title of the page or brochure you are referring to I can find it at AACA. The year would help. That is how everything is cataloged. Don't hold your breathe for an online library. You have no idea how much paper we have. Just the 2000 pages took 60 hours to scan and I hear from about 3 people that have even looked at it.


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2019 11:31 am 
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DougWalters wrote:
David, if you know the title of the page or brochure you are referring to I can find it at AACA. The year would help. That is how everything is cataloged. Don't hold your breathe for an online library. You have no idea how much paper we have. Just the 2000 pages took 60 hours to scan and I hear from about 3 people that have even looked at it.


That's part of the struggle... All I have to go off according to John is what he mentioned "published model and annual production lists". I've looked up those and similar terms and there isn't anything like that on file.

EDIT:
BTW, I've emailed John to see if he can shed any light on it. This is only one example of how tedious the process is currently. It has the potential to be so much more efficient for the user but with the info being so scattered you may be right, it may never be possible.


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2019 7:11 pm 
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David, using their search if you call something a catalog and I have it listed as a brochure you will never find it. That is the problem with all online searches. Even though you may think you know what you are looking for the computer only does what it is told to do. The AACA library is just now implementing a new search system, should be up and running soon. It cost more then the DBC could ever pay for such a system. That is why it bothers me when people say we could handle this better then they do. We are not professionals and the small amount we pay them is worth every penny.


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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 12:08 pm 
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Thanks, Doug

Very true..
I've even searched the term "Dodge Brothers" by it's self and there are 498 hits. I tried this method because I've found most search engines give the user the most complete results with anything related to DB whether it's brochures, catalogs, buses, cars, trucks etc.... If you narrow your search you may lose possible hits. As an example, if you try "Dodge Brothers truck" or trucks you'll see two different result totals which is another reason I just search for anything under the DB name and take the time to sift through it all even though most of it is passenger car related. Same with Graham Brothers.. so there are many variations as you point out .

Most of the truck items at the library are items that are either a.) readily available or b.) nothing new to most of us who are dedicated to researching these trucks. I understand it's because we need more owners to donate but this actually validates the reason we need a truck only digital library so that everyone can input any new literature copies or details they have. I'm not opposed to the AACA having the info. As a matter of fact I wish they would do the very thing I'm speaking of that would allow folks to upload new data into their system somehow so that it could all be in one location. I know it's in safe hands at the AACA and that's really what matters but a digital library is not something that is only in one corner of the world, it would be accessible to everyone worldwide and can be edited with new info by anyone, anywhere with safe guards in place.. for a better understanding of the historical facts .

BTW, I can't wait to experience the new system, I'm hopeful we can uncover some nuggets.

As for the Chrysler Museum, I am waiting for Danielle's boss to reply. He went on vacation yesterday so I'm guessing it could be weeks or months now.


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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 1:01 pm 
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Doug,

I just got off the phone with Matt and Chris and the AACA. My idea isn't very practical for several reasons that Chris took the time to explain, mainly the cost to the DBC for the hosting of the material and other factors.

I guess for now, I'll refocus on a truck registry to see if that may be our best option going forward.


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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 9:34 pm 
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David, I will try to explain another way. ANYONE in the universe can access any information at AACA library, it is a public library. They do not have to be a member of anything but the human race to receive information from there. One of the many problems with the idea of a truck only cloud is money. It takes lots of time to scan and manage a site like you are talking about. Another is lots of truck information transfers to cars so why have duplicate sites? Just like the AACA forum, DBC forum, and two DB face book sites plus all the foreign sites everything is spread out too far and not everyone is registered for all. If ALL the DB 1914 to 1938 paper is in one location, accessible by all it would eliminate missed info, and wasted time. The DBC doesn't even have enough money the library takes for ONE year's budget. I have explained this so many times I am turning blue. It ALL started when I suggested taking our literature out of a member's basement and putting in the AACA library. We pay pennies for this privilege. I was told I was not allowed to be at the BofD meeting to make the presentation. SO it was misrepresented as a donation. It took me a year to convince board members this was not true. People continue to spread this misinterpretation that was never true. We have a written contract, the DBC owns all the literature in our collection. The library has it's own DB literature. I agree with you the DBC would be a better place for Fiat's DB literature. They obviously have no interest in it. Wherever it is no does no one any good. But good luck convincing them of that.


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